Dale North Interview
Dale North has been a presence in the video game music community for almost two decades now, first as an arranger and remixer, and later as a composer. He cut his teeth on music making with OneUp Studios before transitioning to a full-time composer. Having composed for nearly 100 titles, Dale is a veritable treasure trove of knowledge and experience. Sit up, pay attention, and you just must learn something.
You've had a presence in the VGM community for a long time, starting with Time&Space (Green). What prompted you to start writing/covering video game music?
Time & Space was the first project I directed and produced but a lot went into getting to that point. Working backwards, I co-founded OneUp Studios (and the house band, The OneUps), and we worked as producers and arrangers for the whole lineup of Project Majestic Mix albums before we started out on our own as a VGM arrangement record label. That came out of the OCRemix community, which I was one of the original members of.
Continuing backwards, and answering your second question in the process, all that came out of, really, game consoles having a dedicated audio output. For the NES, it was that single RCA line out audio jack, and then the Genesis with its dedicated headphone out port with volume control. I was fascinated by game music since the beginning and being able to use these audio outputs to really hone in on what I was hearing was the start of it all. It wasn't long before I was recording game BGM test modes, later buying soundtracks, and then, I guess, fast forward to now making game soundtracks for a living.
What was your experience in the VGM community for those early albums like Project Majestic among others?
It was so fun and so very busy. Everyone involved was running on pure enthusiasm, and that came directly from the fan support. It felt like we were doing something huge, but we never stopped arranging and recording, trying new things, and meeting other musicians. I learned so much about music making in those early days too.
Who were some of your favorite artists in those early days?
I don't think anything has changed since then—there were always two sets.
First, the composers that wrote all the music that inspired us, and then the more notable arrangers from the VGM/remix scene. So, of course, we all love Nobuo Uematsu and Yasunori Mitsuda and so on (and that list has grown considerably over the years!), but what has been really neat to see is how several of the people from that original scene have gone on to become professionals in the game industry, with a handful being notable composers on their own.
How has the VGM community changed in your opinion?
It has grown so much. The first branches seemed huge at the time but they weren't at all—it's really funny to look back. As someone that worked on one of the very first labels and efforts to spread game music through arrangement, it's been particularly interesting to see that specific avenue expand so much. There are so many labels and so many support companies and sub-businesses that run off this same vein, each doing their own thing. Websites, blogs, awards, communities, forums, and lots of social media accounts sprung up too. Of course, the music has blown up to such a volume that it’s crazy to think about how literally everyone interested in this stuff used to go to one webpage from the one big community to hear a few new songs every week or two. Now, it's overflowing!
What was your experience with the Materia Collective cover albums?
I was in the mix since the beginning, and I was even in the 'room' pushing for the name! I did the first few album launches as an original member, but I haven't contributed much since then for a few reasons, the main reason being that I've been too busy writing my own video game music. What's interesting is that my agent/management and representation, Scarlet Moon Productions, works through Materia Collective (which is now a type of service for our community) on some distribution and licensing matters.
Dale North
When did you start writing original compositions for video games?
Officially? As soon as someone let me. Unofficially...well, remember the talk of recording game music from consoles? I think a lot of us did that, but I don't know that people took that music to their teachers, instructors, and mentors. I did. So many of them helped me explore it, and, looking back, that was huge for me and my future. One person helped me study FM synthesis because I was amazed with how the Sega Genesis sounded. He helped me get my first synth too. My piano teacher let me explore game music through lessons, and in early composition classes, I immediately chose to write mock game music. So, literally, since I could start writing music, I've been writing game music.
Officially, my first work was ghost writing, which I do not recommend. Don't do it. But that work came directly from my visibility in the VGM scene. That may sound great but I'd say it gets you nowhere—I definitely want to make that clear. I thought it would help me too but, I still feel like it was more of a waste and something of a setback. That's all I'll say on that.
Professionally, I started the oldest old school way, mods. Beyond that, anything possible was game—recording or arranging, sound effects, and sometimes a rare instance to write your own piece came along. I was doing game-related fan films and anything around this space that I could too. It was barely professional at times, but one good thing is that I was constantly composing for projects, and I'm really glad about that.
One of the first bigger games I did was the full soundtrack to was Dragon Fantasy Book II, which was picked as one of a few kind of flagship indie games for PlayStation, coming out on PS3, PS4, and Vita. At the time, I was working on many small projects and also in other aspects of the game industry. Seeing the game featured at PlayStation's E3 booth and in their stage show that year really helped push me to commit to making game music a serious full-time job.
What was your first paid gig for an original soundtrack? What were your expectations?
I...don't remember! It was likely small. I did a stint where a small game-making group was making puzzle games, and I put music and sound effects to all of those I could, so it was probably that. I had absolutely no expectations, and that's so funny to say now. I just wanted the opportunity. Even today, I still come at my work with at least a similar energy. I'm just really happy to be able to make game music every day. I'm so glad I have someone else to figure out the pay and business side of things—I really don't like thinking about it!
When did you decide to become a full-time composer? Was it a difficult decision to make?
Age 7. My entire childhood was spent putting my full energy into becoming one. Every bit of optional schooling was toward this goal, and all my free time was spent in lessons or in self-study. Every cent was spent on gear or instruments, and later, games and soundtracks. I was obsessed and charged forward with blinders on through high school and into college.
But it doesn't work like that. Or, it didn't work like that.
There was never a time where I didn't have the desire to become a full-time composer, but there were a lot of times where I just couldn't make it work. I failed a lot. Even with some of the early opportunities I had, I either had the wrong expectations or I just messed it up for myself. Sometimes, I became so frustrated or discouraged that I went off course a bit. I've always at least stayed game music adjacent. but, unfortunately, I spent a few years away from the right levels of drive to get in and do this job properly. I was discouraged and distracted for a stretch, and I really regret it.
One day, while I was at work in a fantastic, well-paying, respected, salaried (with great benefits!) game industry job in downtown San Francisco, the noise in my head became too much. I left that day thanks to a very understanding (and now super supportive) boss, and I'll never forget that commute home. I had no plan or prospects, and now, no money, but I was so happy that I couldn't stop grinning. I cried on the train home. I smiled and cried while looking at the window, daydreaming of how it might all work out. I immediately recaptured that energy of my childhood that day, and that energy has continued to propel me forward.
It's really only been about five years since that day, but I'm nearing 100 credits and have worked on some absolutely fantastic games over that time. My near future holds some exciting developments and a couple of them are literal realizations of dreams I had from childhood. I still can't believe it worked out like this.
Do you prefer to have strict guidelines when composing or do you enjoy a more hands-off approach?
I want as many of the wishes of the client as possible from the beginning, as well as a full understanding of the project, but I prefer a hands-off approach to the music making from there.
What are some of the biggest misconceptions about being a full-time composer?
I don't know what the biggest ones are, but I know the ones I see quite often in my work. One of the main ones is that people assume career composers write in only selected styles or genres. That's funny to me as I don't think many of us could make a living being so selective. We really have to be able to address the full breadth of music to stay afloat.
Another is how much time goes into the work, and really how much work it is overall. It's possible to spend half a year writing ten pieces for a game, which seems weird to the lay-person for what is essentially background music. And there's no guarantee that the client will even like those ten pieces, you know? This is hard work, sometimes unforgivingly so. It's somewhat thankless, super time-intensive, and often misunderstood by game makers themselves. You've got to really want to do this job, I say. Nothing about it is easy, and I think being okay with that is one of the most important parts of making this work.
What were some of the most important lessons that you learned from being a composer?
I've learned so many things that it's hard to line them up by importance. One of the first things I learned is that I knew nothing near what I thought I did. I made so many mistakes, and with that, I learned some humility. Patience has also been one of the biggest lessons learned. The game industry so weird and varied and ever-changing that having expectations that things will fall in line for your timeline is like holding the door open for disappointment. Nothing stays on schedule! Things fall apart all the time.
I've learned that being a team player is often much more important than any of my musical abilities. I've learned so much about budgeting as a business owner. I've learned to pick my battles.
I guess the biggest lesson that came from a lot of these and other lessons is that we work in service of the game as a composer. It's not about us. It should never be about us. Our job is to bring what we uniquely do to help make the game exactly what it's trying to be. We’re almost always working on someone else's dream, and we are caring for someone else's baby.
What were some of the more challenging soundtracks that you've composed?
I can't think of one that didn't challenge me! I've been learning along the way with every single one of them, and I hope that I'm growing through these efforts. Each soundtrack has different challenges—timelines, budgets, communication, and expectations. There are definitely recurring themes among these challenges as well.
I guess Wizard of Legend was the most challenging, but it had little to do with the above listed concerns. It was more that I was pushing myself so hard that I don't think I've ever felt that challenged. The big thing I got from this work is that there are some rewards to setting up challenges for yourself. Now, I make it a point to push myself in one way or another for every new game I sign on to.
“People showing us who they are through the lens of game music always inspires me.”
What has been the most rewarding soundtrack that you've composed?
There are so many measures of reward to look at. Some soundtracks have rewarded me with visibility or monetary returns, others with repeat business. Some are just personally rewarding.
The Long Return came to me when I was busy and stressed with other work that being able to freely write and express myself in my own way for a full game was immensely rewarding. I listen to my work on that and hear mainly relief. I hear a lot of the joy of creating I want to express in my work all the time, but can't always. It isn't the most popular game I've worked on, but somehow has ended up as one of the most appreciated. So there's two big rewards there.
Do you still arrange covers? Do you have any favorite cover artists?
I don't unless it's for fun, and that's mostly because I'm so busy these days. I probably won't ever release game music arrangements ever again unless it's in an official capacity, and there are a few reasons for that.
One of the biggest reasons stems from the early days of our label, OneUp Studios. It got to the point to where our releases were popular enough that we were making a decent amount of money on the sales. We were among the first to properly license our released works, so there was no issues there, but I couldn't help but feel conflicted about profiting from others' works. When things were going really well, we received some criticism that we were making money off of things we supposedly loved. That felt weird to me. It still does. It's what caused me to release ownership of the label and eventually caused me to leave that community—I felt that strongly about it.
The original intent of OCRemix, where I got my start along with so many others, was to explore and celebrate game music through arrangement and covers. That felt great. Making money from others' works didn't always feel great, even it it was my own arrangement and artistry, and it was fully licensed and legal.
As someone that has always wanted to be a game music maker myself, I thought a lot about how I'd feel if someone covered my music. The initial feeling is that I'd be honored. It has been an absolute honor to stumble on, say, arrangements of Wizard of Legend songs on YouTube, or see a couple of live orchestral performances of my work last year. I love that. But it really comes down to motivations for me. Are you arranging and releasing this work because you adore it? Or is the primary goal a monetary return?
I don't think any composer out there would feel good about hearing that a cover album or even a cover song was released with monetary return as the main motivation. I'd hate it. So, when these groups I worked with started to feel like our releases were products, it was easy for me to make the call. That didn't feel right for me. That's not a judgement against others that are, say, doing day and date cover releases with big announcements. Nevertheless, what stands true for me is that if I composed that music and saw that release and its timing, I'd at least question the motivation, and I wouldn't like it, no matter how good the production was. So, again, outside of official work, which I've done a lot of and hope to continue doing, I won't release anymore.
I still love covering game music. I started on a cover of "Kiss Me Goodbye" from Final Fantasy XII last week, and I'll put it up on YouTube when I'm done.
These days, I have lots of favorites, but what I've noticed is that they've stayed the same since the beginning days. I love Po, Star Salzman, and Joshua Morse—they all have very fresh, inspired approaches to covers.
Who are some of your biggest inspirations in the current VGM community?
I'm just so inspired by people doing their own thing. People showing us who they are through the lens of game music always inspires me. Self-expression coming through VGM is the best.
Links for Dale North
Twitter
Materia Collective
YouTube
Dale loves Corgis.